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Regular Infantry
grey_area
Posts: 1,465
Registered: 07-20-2008

Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

Well this is... frustrating. Is Half-Life 3 in the works? (Or Half-Life 2 Episode 3, if they would even consider keeping it with the previous title). Apparently Gabe Newell knows HL fans are annoyed that we haven't heard anything about the final(?) installment, especially since Valve refuses to say anything about it anyway.

 

Article from the Escapist anyhoo.

 

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/115913-Gabe-Newell-Acknowledges-Frustrations-With-Half-Lif...

 

We did get another Duke Nukem eventually, so there is hope that Valve will do something about their game franchise too.

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Egglick
Posts: 8,455
Registered: 01-28-2004

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

Dang episodic crap was a bad idea from the start.  I still haven't played either of the two episodes, despite owning them for years.

 

I mean, if you're going to experiment with something which might crash and burn, I sure as hell wouldn't use your flagship title.


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Regular Infantry
grey_area
Posts: 1,465
Registered: 07-20-2008

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

Well, the good thing about the two episodes, and HL2 itself, is that they are still damned good fun to play even now, and TBH, while I'd like another sequel I don't need one. It would be nice to round out the experience though.

 

I think their main fear would be that it would get the DNF treatment for not being God's Own game that would bless all who play it with super powers or something. However, unlike DNF, they haven't been going on about it being in producution for over a decade so there is that. Still, will be a hard title to live up to, and that might make some developers wary of returning to it.

Human Shield
FiSH
Posts: 16,938
Registered: 02-09-2005

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

Not sure why another episode would be even remotely considered at this point . . . unless it's released at the same time an announcement for HL3 is made. Kind of a party starter. Otherwise, they should just bring on HL3. We all know they're working on it. It's their bread and butter. They're just treating its development like Area 51.
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sqitso
Posts: 15,537
Registered: 09-08-2004

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

What I would do... Release Episode 3 as an entire game which is comprised of 1 and 2... so you can play from the beginning all the way through 3. It would seem like a long game for those who have never played it.. and may promote sales.

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Manslaughterer
Synchronous Failure
Posts: 4,319
Registered: 08-12-2009

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

[ Edited ]

They should just release Episode 3 and finish off the immediate storyline. Have Episode 3 be the final, ultimate update to the Source Engine and then announce Half-Life 3 and Source Engine 2. Have HL3 be the last Half-Life game but not necessarily the last game in the universe, just an end to Gordon Freeman's saga so Valve can move on and do something new without worry.

 

But I trust Valve with whatever they're planning. They've never once disappointed me and I have tons of games to occupy my time with until their next release.

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Delta Force
Callred
Posts: 7,526
Registered: 03-23-2005

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

Gordon is getting a little old for running around hitting people with a crow bar... By now he's settled down with Alex and they have like five kids... maybe have one of his daughters or sons take up the fight and move on from there. An Alex-looking woman with Gordon's glasses. A Hipster-Ironic type. She can attitude the aliens to death. Her Mom was sure good at it.

 

Portal 2 was the trainer for how to use the toys he's going to find and there's still the missing Borealis. So maybe have the end of Ep2 be the start of HL3, blend the last episode into the newest game..   either way, I want it so I can put the damned game to rest...


Regular Infantry
grey_area
Posts: 1,465
Registered: 07-20-2008

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

I was not trying to indicate that I thought there  be another "episode" game using the Half-life 2 name. In truth I didn't even think of EP1 or EP2 as episodes, but short games in their own right. Anything now won't have the episode label attached to it at all, or HL2. But yes, I do think it will just carry on from where EP2 finished and run straight through.

 

Of course they may even do the latest trick we've seen in other games and not even attach a series number to it. Just call it something like Half-Life: The Portal Gun.

 

I can just see Gordon flashing a couple of worm holes so he can death from above the combine with his crowbar!

Manslaughterer
Synchronous Failure
Posts: 4,319
Registered: 08-12-2009

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

They're not going to include any Portal elements to the next game beyond mentioning Aperture Science and what they were up to with the Borealis. Though they may be in the same universe, Portal and Half-Life are two different games and should remain that way. I don't want to Portal Gun my way through a bunch of levels like I already have with two other games.

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Regular Infantry
mclaren_man
Posts: 938
Registered: 08-09-2004

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

HL3 is in development, and if not, then they're working on the new tech for it. Do I have proof? I don't, but I'm not stupid enough to believe they're not doing anything about it. The Source engine is outdated and I'm sure they're going to bring out all the stops for the next one, whenever that is.

It's only natural that Gabe wouldn't talk about it. Like you guys said, this isn't just another game. It's their lovechild and they're not going to say anything until they know it's time. I'm sure they don't want another leaked unfinished product like before, so they're keeping it locked up tighter than a nuns vajayjay.

The fact that everyone wants it out only further cements that there will be a next one. One of the best gaming franchises, if not the best, is not going to end just like that.
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Regular Infantry
grey_area
Posts: 1,465
Registered: 07-20-2008

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

I think this line from the article sums it up quite well:

 

"On the other hand, we're still talking about [Half-Life 3], which I suppose speaks well of Valve's ability to keep the conversation going while simultaneously staying out of it"

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sqitso
Posts: 15,537
Registered: 09-08-2004

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

Source and the rage engine are both in a pickle.. Source is outdated and rage is too new and comlicated.. I am so sick of the Unreal engine that I could puke.  Frostbyte looks like it has promise, but imh it doesn't play well single player. Skryim has a very nice engine but not sure if you could do a faster paced game with it. I am very curious about Far Cry 3... it's a big update to a solid engine that has always been scrutinized. I never sang the Crysis games praises as a whole.. but as an engine they are always impressive. I just wish they could get the best of both worlds.. good single player and good multuplayer.. which in my opinion only has two engines that do both well at the same time.. Souce and Unreal.

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Manslaughterer
Synchronous Failure
Posts: 4,319
Registered: 08-12-2009

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

Why would Valve use someone else's engine? They will make their own replacement for the Source Engine and lease it out to other companies and make a killing off of it.

 

And Skyrim's engine is far from nice. It's ancient and due for a complete replacement.

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mclaren_man
Posts: 938
Registered: 08-09-2004

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

I'm with Synch on this. Skyrim engine is fine and all, but for a HL title it doesn't work. They will use their own uniquely styled engine.

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sqitso
Posts: 15,537
Registered: 09-08-2004

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3


Synchronous Failure wrote:

Why would Valve use someone else's engine? They will make their own replacement for the Source Engine and lease it out to other companies and make a killing off of it.

 

And Skyrim's engine is far from nice. It's ancient and due for a complete replacement.


Always comes down to money.. if it's cheaper to lease someone else's engine.. then that is why. Valve has so many titles they take credit for, they could get away with outsourcing another engine.. people like ID are kind of pride themselves on their own engine. So they wind up hemorrhaging money until they recoup dev costs. To be honest. In this market, a game's lifespan is so short it would be very difficult to get all your money back if you start from scratch. One of the reasons people haven't seen a new engine on COD for a long ass time. They gonna milk that cow for everything it's worth.

What about the Chome engine? Didn't Dead Island use that? I could totally see the Half Life universe in that engine.. 

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Manslaughterer
Synchronous Failure
Posts: 4,319
Registered: 08-12-2009

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

[ Edited ]

sqitso wrote:

Synchronous Failure wrote:

Why would Valve use someone else's engine? They will make their own replacement for the Source Engine and lease it out to other companies and make a killing off of it.

 

And Skyrim's engine is far from nice. It's ancient and due for a complete replacement.


Always comes down to money.. if it's cheaper to lease someone else's engine.. then that is why. Valve has so many titles they take credit for, they could get away with outsourcing another engine.. people like ID are kind of pride themselves on their own engine. So they wind up hemorrhaging money until they recoup dev costs. To be honest. In this market, a game's lifespan is so short it would be very difficult to get all your money back if you start from scratch. One of the reasons people haven't seen a new engine on COD for a long ass time. They gonna milk that cow for everything it's worth.

What about the Chome engine? Didn't Dead Island use that? I could totally see the Half Life universe in that engine.. 


Yes, but that's not Valve. Valve is just as prideful, if not more so, and would never use someone else's engine for their baby. If they were truly milking their franchises we would have been up to Half-Life 5 by now. The only reason for this absurd length of time spent on development is quite simply the creation of a new engine. Thanks to Steam, Valve can afford to create their own engine and with a new engine they can create sequels to all of the other franchises under their belt. The Source Engine is as much a part of Valve's brand as Half-Life itself. Leasing it out to other companies would expand Valve's market share considerably and help them out in the long run versus using an old, foreign engine.

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Veteran Rifleman
One Fan To Another
Posts: 2,603
Registered: 01-09-2004

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

[ Edited ]

grey_area wrote:

Well, the good thing about the two episodes, and HL2 itself, is that they are still damned good fun to play even now, and TBH, while I'd like another sequel I don't need one. It would be nice to round out the experience though.

 

I think their main fear would be that it would get the DNF treatment for not being God's Own game that would bless all who play it with super powers or something. However, unlike DNF, they haven't been going on about it being in producution for over a decade so there is that. Still, will be a hard title to live up to, and that might make some developers wary of returning to it.


     That is the exact reason the rest of the series hasn't come out.  THE EXACT REASON.

 

     Remember how Nintendo was purposely holding back on Wii units to make it seem like it was so 'in' that it was hard to get?  You know how Apple some how manages to get people to line up over night for the next iPhone when it turns out they have enough units for everyone, including those who come later in the day with zero waiting?

     It's all marketing.  Valve has inexplicably gotten game obsessed fools to think that they are more than just some company that made a couple of good games.  Valve hasn't done SHIT that any other company hasn't.  Once getting the reputation that they have they convinced developers to pay them to release games on a proprietary system (the worst thing that can happen to any segment of any business), which they were then able to convince everyone was a good thing (even after everyone hated it at first).

 

     Why complete their game?  Why bother?  They can sit back, have everyone praise them for something good they did 10+ years ago and rake in cash from the mindless dumb-asses who buy junk because it happens to be on sale for $4.  $4?!  Well, shit, son - I can't afford not to buy that!

 

     You f**king suck, Valve.

 

     Side Note: Oh, and as for episodic gaming?  When Valve announced that they were going that way I warned that it was the next step toward the death of PC gaming and all of you guys argued with me while defending your precious Valve.  Now, absolutely everyone - EVERYONE - knows that it was a huge mistake that did, as Egg put it, crash and burn.  Do you know why it went away?  It wasn't because people didn't buy it - they most certainly did.  It's because the publishers realized that people were even bigger suckers than they had originally thought.  Why get people to pay $20 for an "episode" - something that takes a long time to make - when you can make a full game, then hack out portions of it and resell them back to that original customer as DLC for and even higher cost?  Or even just singular items for cash.

 

     The people have spoken:  They want to pay $60 for their games, they want to have incomplete games, they want to pay after the fact for more content that they would have gotten in the first place, and they have zero intention of changing their minds.

Veteran Rifleman
One Fan To Another
Posts: 2,603
Registered: 01-09-2004

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

[ Edited ]

FiSH wrote:
Not sure why another episode would be even remotely considered at this point . . . unless it's released at the same time an announcement for HL3 is made. Kind of a party starter. Otherwise, they should just bring on HL3. We all know they're working on it. It's their bread and butter. They're just treating its development like Area 51.

     Isn't Steam their bread and butter?  I mean Valve only really has HL (and the off-shoot Portal) and Left For Dead.  If we forget about Steam for a sec HL isn't their bread and butter, it's their ONLY real source of income (Portal 2 is HL).  That is to say that they wouldn't be a company without it.  Bring Steam back into the picture (and realize that the main HL series hasn't been around for a years and years) and see that Steam is almost all they have.  They release a partially completed game every couple of years for upkeep purposes.

     Remember when Portal 2 was announced.  Right before hand Valve released a statement saying that they had a huge announcement coming up.  Everyone thought they meant that it would be HL related.  Instead they announced that they had made a sequel to a what was essentially a 3 hour mod.  Why would Valve do that?  Why would Valve spend the time making Portal 2 - something that wasn't really at the front of people's minds - instead spending that exact amount of time on the next HL?  Well, for upkeep, of course.  Portal, unlike HL, loses traction as time goes by.  Since Valve only has a grand total of three real properties they need to release things in a sequence that will maintain their business.  They could make a HL sequel 10 years from now and people will still buy it in droves.  They need to dose this shit out just the right amount at just the right time.

Human Shield
FiSH
Posts: 16,938
Registered: 02-09-2005

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

My bet is that they have plenty of content at this point. Stuff already created and playable. Hell, they may have the entire game already created with the existing engine, just waiting for the right time to either give it an overhaul or recreate it from the ground up based on what they have. I just find it tough to believe that Half Life has ever remained dormant as far as development goes.

There's a lot riding on a follow up to what many regard as the greatest game of all time. So it's understandable that they keep progress under wraps until they're confident that they have something that can be held in a similar regard. Newell's gonna be a perfectionist with it. That you can be sure of.
Veteran Rifleman
One Fan To Another
Posts: 2,603
Registered: 01-09-2004

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3


FiSH wrote:
My bet is that they have plenty of content at this point. Stuff already created and playable. Hell, they may have the entire game already created with the existing engine, just waiting for the right time to either give it an overhaul or recreate it from the ground up based on what they have. I just find it tough to believe that Half Life has ever remained dormant as far as development goes.

There's a lot riding on a follow up to what many regard as the greatest game of all time. So it's understandable that they keep progress under wraps until they're confident that they have something that can be held in a similar regard. Newell's gonna be a perfectionist with it. That you can be sure of.

     Who the heck thinks that?  If you mean HL1 than, sure, I... guess... I could see that.  HL2 wasn't even as good as the first one was, it didn't change a single thing in video games, unlike the first one, it had no ending at all (as we all complain about, even now in this thread - hell, it's the point of this thread), and I've never even seen one of those silly "Top 10/50/100/etc games of all time" lists with it at the top.

     I think anyone that would call HL2 the greatest game of all time isn't being very objective.  There's nothing terribly wrong with using one's emotional connection to a game experience as a gauge for said game's quality or "goodness" but that not how "best ever" is defined.

 

Back on topic: While, sure, Valve COULD have HL3 near completion for we know, in this day and age that is so unlikely to have happened without leaks, or something like that, that I can't personally believe it.

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sqitso
Posts: 15,537
Registered: 09-08-2004

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

While again everyone could theorize.. yet another theory is that resources from valve are pooled towards other projects and there isn't a single shred of work being done on HL3.. simply because it is a money pit and they could easily make more money on cheap stuff they buy from other people and sell for 10 bucks on Steam. HL3 would be millions of dollars to create.. yes millions upon millions.. Hell I worked on Freelancer like 10 years ago and over 50 million dollars was spent before that game was released.. and that was 10 years ago. To make the game worthwhile it would have to be amazing which means it would cost a crap load of time and money. Why do that when you can pay some Independant company a few thousand bucks for a game to sell on Steam and make huge profits with little to know risk? We might see a half life 3.. but if we do.. it is not because Valve is shooting for the moon on HL3 sales.. they are simply looking to lease their engine.. would would have to be amazing in itself. With the competition there is already.. I can't see a smart business man re-inventing the wheel. There is nothing you can do in a new game engine that hasn't been done before. When Half Life 1 came out it did something unique.. the first game to have colored lighting effects. Stuff light that drew people to the engine. Now... nah.. there is nothing you can create that will draw a crowd like that. I just don't see it happening. Just my opinion though.

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Black Ops
Egglick
Posts: 8,455
Registered: 01-28-2004

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

^ Don't want to get too far off topic, but Freelancer was a great game. 


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sqitso
Posts: 15,537
Registered: 09-08-2004

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3


Egglick wrote:

^ Don't want to get too far off topic, but Freelancer was a great game. 


Well if you played it to the end.. you can tell that Microsoft had enough and just told the team to finish the game anyway they could with the resources they had. That was something they promised Chris Roberts they wouldn't do. There was still a lot to be done, and the story interactions "Which I may add where the same as Mass Effect long before Mass Effect" where cut out and funds where stopped. Microsoft got tired of dumping money and not seeing a game release. Chris stopped even coming to the office like a month after Microsoft started being a dicks. He was pretty pissed.

 

That pissed everyone off because if you loved Wing Commander you sooo wanted the Freelancer world to work....but that is an entirely different thread and story.

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Human Shield
FiSH
Posts: 16,938
Registered: 02-09-2005

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

Ya know, I'd be perfectly happy with a HL3 whose graphics mirrored that of Portal 2. The game looks super and everything runs as smooth as silk. Not sure why we're not seeing more games using that upgraded version of the Source engine. If not the next HL, throw another shooter our way using it.
Manslaughterer
Synchronous Failure
Posts: 4,319
Registered: 08-12-2009

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

Yeah, I still think the Source Engine looks great. As I've said before, how good something looks depends mostly on the art style and not the technology that goes behind it.

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sqitso
Posts: 15,537
Registered: 09-08-2004

Re: Gabe Newell, not talking about Half-Life 3

Who knows.. there could be engine limitations that prevent it from competing.. when you see some of the mocap intergrations and stuff they have now days.. maybe Source is still lacking something to make it competitive. For all we know the engine could have a poly count limitation based on old hardware specs from the time.

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